MARKISHA MOTTON: What is your full name, sir?
MARTEL MILLER: My name is Martel Miller.
MARKISHA MOTTON: What year were you born, sir?
MARTEL MILLER: 1960 - July 4th.
MARKISHA MOTTON: Where did you live, and with whom?
MARTEL MILLER: I lived with my mother and father in Champaign.
MARKISHA MOTTON: What educational expectations did your parents
play [sic]?
MARTEL MILLER: To make sure I went to school and to tell me to
get the best education possible.
MARKISHA MOTTON: What church did you attend?
MARTEL MILLER: Pilgrim Baptist Church.
MARKISHA MOTTON: And what role did the church play in your life?
MARTEL MILLER: Taught me to care and religion; it steered me
right.
MARKISHA MOTTON: Thank you for your time.
MARTEL MILLER: Right.
MARKISHA MOTTON: I know that you said that you don't want this
generation to be like you were when you were a kid. What things
do you remember were in school as a young child?
MARTEL MILLER: I remember when I went to Marquette. It was like
walking distance from the house. It was a nice school. I had
black teachers, a black principal, and it was just like being
with my own, like being at home.
MARKISHA MOTTON: Were there any incidents where you remember you
getting into fights or you being good or-
MARTEL MILLER: Yeah, I was real good. I was only in kindergarten
and 1st grade there. Then they bused me to Southside, to the
west side of Champaign, and that's when things changed with me
as far as education.
MARKISHA MOTTON: What was your principal's name at Marquette?
MARTEL MILLER: Mr. McKinney.
MARKISHA MOTTON: When you were bused to the other school, were
there any problems on the bus?
MARTEL MILLER: Yeah. Our problems started before we got on the
bus. We could be waiting for the bus from 7:35, 8:15, it don't
matter if it was raining, snowing, whatever, we had to wait for
the bus. And when we got to school, we was probably soaking wet,
and the kids just laughed at us and whatever.
MARKISHA MOTTON: Were there many white children that would say
rude comments?
MARTEL MILLER: Oh, yeah, when we got to Southside, yeah, we had
that. And then we felt-I won't say "we" felt-I'd say I felt like
that we was like second rate citizens, 'cause we didn't get the
same treatment, like they didn't want us there.
MARKISHA MOTTON: How do you think that your teachers educated
you at Southside? Did they treat the white children-
MARTEL MILLER: Yes.
MARKISHA MOTTON: --better?
MARTEL MILLER: I felt they got a different kind of treatment
than what we had. If we put a real hard effort in, they may help
us a little more, but if you had like a-if you weren't
interested, they didn't really push you on.
MARKISHA MOTTON: Did you feel wanted at Marquette or at
Southside?
MARTEL MILLER: Marquette was just almost like my regular
environment. When I went to Southside, it was like - it was more
of a changed environment for me. It was something I wasn't used
to.
MARKISHA MOTTON: So are you saying that you liked Marquette
better than-
MARTEL MILLER: Yeah, I did.
MARKISHA MOTTON: What high school did you attend?
MARTEL MILLER: I went to Central.
MARKISHA MOTTON: What middle school did you attend?
MARTEL MILLER: I went to Edison.
MARKISHA MOTTON: At Edison, were the African-American males
treated like Caucasian males?
MARTEL MILLER: No, we had our problems there, too, especially
with sports. You know, you really had to be a super star. You
could be better than a lot of other players, but to be on the
team or play, we actually had to be super stars.
MARKISHA MOTTON: I interviewed another person earlier, and they
said that black males were sent to the basement. In the time
period that you went to school, were there males in the basement
or was that a different period?
MARTEL MILLER: They had like a special ed room that they had at
Edison which was a majority, probably 99% black.
MARKISHA MOTTON: Were you sent there because you were black or
were there problems with what you did?
MARTEL MILLER: No, I wasn't in there, but several people were in
there that I know that had been in regular class.
MARKISHA MOTTON: Are there any teachers that you felt really
discouraged you when you were growing up in the middle school,
Edison?
MARTEL MILLER: Yeah, I had one teacher. I'd rather not mention
his name, but we were having Black History Month. And they would
always, from grade school all the way through junior high
school, we talked about the same people: Martin Luther King,
Malcolm X, George Washington Carver, and a few others, but they
never had brought in the real black history. And my sister was a
black history major, and I brought some books in to school. They
just told us to bring stuff from home. And when I brought it to
his desk and showed him, he knocked 'em on the floor. And me and
him had like a little scuffle, and from then I probably changed
my way I looked at education.
MARKISHA MOTTON: What role did your race play in your
experiences educationally and subsequently?
MARTEL MILLER: Educationwise, I feel I should have been educated
in a different manner, 'cause we had different histories and
different backgrounds, different social issues. And I think the
schools should deal with a lot of issues, and I think I would
have gotten a lot better education. And if you wanna go to the
work world, that's a whole different thing there. [chuckle]
MARKISHA MOTTON: You said that you attended Central High School?
MARTEL MILLER: Yeah, I attended Central High School.
MARKISHA MOTTON: There, were you forced to take workshop or-
MARTEL MILLER: Yeah, I would take shop, and they would give the
black kids-they wouldn't give 'em-I'd say the requirement
course-they'd actually let you pick your courses, which they
know you didn't know what you were really doing, that you were
setting yourself up for a lifetime of failure if you didn't take
the required courses and took the advanced courses and stuff
like that. They weren't really preparing you for college or for
any higher learning.
MARKISHA MOTTON: Were there certain teachers that discouraged
you in high school?
MARTEL MILLER: As I say, with a certain teacher, just certain
things they did in high school discouraged a lot of black males.
MARKISHA MOTTON: Was there a teacher that told you that you
could do anything you wanna do and tried to encourage you to be
successful in life?
MARTEL MILLER: Yeah, they would say that, but as far as puttin'
it where it would make a difference in your life by education,
they would always say that, but like I say, they would tell you
to take-like you'd be taking woodshop, small engines, art, and
what you should have been taking, a lot more English courses,
math courses, and stuff that would help you, where you could
advance yourself with education.
MARKISHA MOTTON: Were there any Caucasian people that would make
fun of you when you were in high school? Are there any incidents
where you remember that you were offended racially?
MARTEL MILLER: Yes, when I went to high school, we used to have
like little racial riots and stuff, and they would start from
like one incident would start. And the next day, there'd be
another incident. Then it would just carry on. That's like '78,
'79. That's probably one of the-'78 and '79, that's probably one
of the years Central had racial riots.
MARKISHA MOTTON: What role did community organizations play in
your education?
MARTEL MILLER: When I was in grade school, and better yet, it'd
be junior high school, we brought homework up to Bethel Church.
We'd be able to get like cookies, brownies, candy, or something,
but you had to bring homework.
MARKISHA MOTTON: Was there a boys' and girls' club that you
attended?
MARTEL MILLER: Yeah, I was in the boys' and girls' club, too.
Boys' and girls' club showed us character and helped us with our
homework, and they got us tutors and showed us-We had like field
trips. They showed us different things, you know, like going to
baseball games, football games, and museums. They showed us a
lot of things that we didn't really get to learn in school.
MARKISHA MOTTON: What role did the black church play in your
life?
MARTEL MILLER: For me, it's just-it really taught me religion,
taught me how to deal with people and just taught me right,
steered me the right way.
MARKISHA MOTTON: Were there any riots or protesting that you
were in, protesting about something?
MARTEL MILLER: No, I didn't protest. I mean, I was [inaudible]
school riots.
MARKISHA MOTTON: And what was that riot caused by?
MARTEL MILLER: [chuckle] I'd say it was caused by
incidents-someone was blocking the driveway, and the person
wanted to leave, and they yelled out a racial slur. And it ended
up in an altercation where the person struck the other person
and someone got out of the car and one fight-and then from one
fight it went to probably eight or nine fights. And it went on
probably about 2 or 3 days. That was in '78.
MARKISHA MOTTON: Were there any specific things that you
remember your parents telling you about how to stay focused on
schoolwork and not to pay attention to what some people might
say to you?
MARTEL MILLER: Yeah, my parents always said that. My parents are
from the South, so they had it a lot rougher than I had it. And
they knew education was the way. I had both parents at my house;
I had a father and a mother. But a lot of my friends grew up
without a father, and that makes a lot of difference in the
household.
MARKISHA MOTTON: We have a little [inaudible] that I got on you,
that you attended Bottenfeld?
MARTEL MILLER: Yeah, I attended Bottenfeld too. I was bused to
two schools.
MARKISHA MOTTON: Did you know Anita Patterson from Bottenfeld?
MARTEL MILLER: Anita Patterson?
MARKISHA MOTTON: In your high school days, was there a certain
time where you felt as though you were ready to quit, or was
there a certain time that you felt as though you could really do
it and you were gonna-
MARTEL MILLER: I feel I was misled in high school. When I was in
12th grade, they told me in April, all the way up to April, they
had made me believe that I was graduating. In April, they told
me I wasn't gonna graduate because of an incident that I was
involved in, in 10th grade, when I didn't take my final, a
semester U.S. History, for not taking my final. But they
could've told me that before my senior year. And I feel like-I
dropped out of school in like April.
MARKISHA MOTTON: Do you think that integration was a good thing
or a bad thing for African-American students?
MARTEL MILLER: I think it would've been a good thing if they had
showed us-had more black teachers and more black people with the
integration part, instead of just taking the kids and shipping
them to a whole new environment. And all you would see were the
white teachers, and everybody was in authority, and no one you
could really come to. I had a black p.e. teacher in Southside,
and there was a black cook there in Edison. They had like
janitors, cooks, and I think we had Mr. Jackson-we probably had
four black teachers or five black teachers out of all of Edison.
And today it's about still the same.
MARKISHA MOTTON: What do you think of the school systems today?
MARTEL MILLER: School systems today? They could do a lot better,
and I think it's a lot of social issues in there, which the
administrators, school board should be addressing, other than
doing what they're doing, which I see is nothing. You know? It's
just a lot of problems in the schools. I've been dealing with
the school systems for about over 20 years. I'm in probably four
schools daily, and I see a lot of issues that they're not even
addressing or if they're addressing it, they need to go about it
in another manner. And at the high school, I see the police up
there all the time, which I feel that is real wrong, 'cause you
don't get a chance to be kids. Like those kids get into
altercations. Instead of being able to sit down and talk about
it and shake hands and become friends, they end up with criminal
records.
MARKISHA MOTTON: [inaudible] the segregation in the schools
between the honors and the regular classes there?
MARTEL MILLER: Yes, that's the problem we had. Instead of
pushing the kids to take higher level classes, you know-My
daughter is in the higher level classes. And she complains
because she's the only black in her class. There's only two
blacks in her class. But I know there's more kids to be able to
do that. But there's not - let me see how I wanna say this. It's
not that they ain't tending to the issues that stop them from
getting in them classes, 'cause it's not that they don't know
the work; it's that there's something probably going on at home
or something is blocking them from really working up to their
potential.
MARKISHA MOTTON: In my honors classes that I am in in Franklin,
there are three African-American females, and there's one male.
What do you think of that compared to when you go into a regular
class, you'll see all African-Americans and only two Caucasian
students?
MARTEL MILLER: I see that they should be working on figuring out
why they don't have many African-Americans in a lot of things,
'cause there's a lot of-there's more talent than in basketball
and sports. There's a lot of smart African-American males, but
they need to find a new way to teach or a new way to reach 'em,
because to me, I really feel there's a generational gap which
needs to be addressed. There's a lot of African-American males
that are gonna lose.
MARKISHA MOTTON: Since you see young African-American children
almost every day throughout the school system, the boys' and
girls' clubs and just in general in your neighborhood, do you
try to stress to the young people of your community and the
schools that you visit that education is important and to keep
theirselves out of trouble? Because there are a lot of
African-American males and some young females that get into a
lot of trouble. Do you try to stress to them that education is
the way to go and that they should try to stay focused on that
instead of in gangs and the other things that aren't
appropriate?
MARTEL MILLER: I talk to kids every day about education. I talk
to every kid every day about behavior. I talk to kids every day
about respecting their elders and respecting theirself really,
you know. If a kid is cussing and acting out, that shows his
character.
MARKISHA MOTTON: What could make it even better than it is
today?
MARTEL MILLER: I'd say up 'til probably about 2 years ago, I
thought Unit 4 was doing fine. But in the last 2 years, I look
at it, to me they're going backwards.
MARKISHA MOTTON: Backwards?
MARTEL MILLER: Yeah, and probably especially it's really with
communicating with our youths, you know? And there's a lot of
things I feel they could do different; they should try to use
people out of the community and try to be seen more in the
schools and to like come into the Boys' Club Douglass Center,
checking to validate functions like that, the schools'
administrators. I'd say the leaders of the community ought to be
showing their faces around our youths a little more so they'll
know where they are.
MARKISHA MOTTON: If you could change the school system today,
how would you change it, and why?
MARTEL MILLER: If I could change the school system today, I
would probably get some people out of the community to help them
with dealing with the kids, the youth of today. The youth today
is under attack by the media, by social things. And there's just
so much that's going on in their lives that we didn't have to
deal with when we were growing up. I think they need to use
someone other than social workers, police department, Children
and Family Services. They need like someone to mediate and help.
I really think our schools need like a truant officer, someone
to keep an eye on the kids. Too many kids can walk the streets
today.
MARKISHA MOTTON: If you could go back in time, is there anything
you would change about your school experiences? Why?
MARTEL MILLER: I would work harder in school, and I would
probably go as far as I can with education, and that's so I
could probably be able to teach. And I really [inaudible] back
to school. I really haven't started school already.
MARKISHA MOTTON: How do you look at the young people today that
are doing something with their life? Do you think that they will
succeed in life?
MARTEL MILLER: If they stay positive and stay away from the
wrong crowd and go to school and go to college-they'll make it.
MARKISHA MOTTON: Given your experience, what type of student
would you be in today's society?
MARTEL MILLER: In today's society, I'd probably be-I'd pay more
attention to my schoolwork, and I wouldn't have played as much
and wasted the time that I did when I was growing up. I would
really get educated and work on getting an education.
MARKISHA MOTTON: Why?
MARTEL MILLER: Because that's what you need. Like I say, I would
like to teach. I think it would make life a little easier. I
know it would. I shouldn't even say think-I know it would make
life a little easier.
MARKISHA MOTTON: Do you see your kids doing better than you
might have in your school district?
MARTEL MILLER: Yes, I do, because I'm pushing them everyday. I'm
checking on them everyday. I'm talking with their teachers. I'm
talking with their principals. I'm talking with their
counselors. I'll go where they hang out. If they hang out at the
boys' club, I'll go over to the boys' club. I watch my kids. I
know where they're at.
MARKISHA MOTTON: I have one more question for you. If you could
tell young African-American children one thing, what would it
be, and why?
MARTEL MILLER: I would tell them to respect theirself. And that
is a big problem with our kids. They don't respect theirself. If
you don't respect yourself, you won't never get respect. And I
would tell them to get the best education possible and work at
self-employment. Don't work at being employed; work at
self-employment. Figure out what you would do to employ yourself
and make yourself marketable.
MARKISHA MOTTON: I'm sorry, sir. I have one more question for
you. What role should the black parents play in life?
MARTEL MILLER: Like all parents should play in life, any kind of
parent, from a black parent to a white parent, just raise your
young, watch your young, educate your young, teach them manners
and make sure they have their own character. Don't wanna be like
Mike; be yourself. Be successful. Try to be some-and that's our
kids' problems; they want to be something they're not.
MARKISHA MOTTON: I'd like to thank you for your time and I'd
like to thank you for your time.
MARTEL MILLER: Thanks, Markisha.
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Martel Miller was born in Champaign in 1960 and was one of the first
group of Black school children to be bused from the north end to the
south end of town to desegregate the schools. He is an educational
consultant.
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to the Martel Miller interview