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Interview Transcript
This interview was with Dr. Nina Patterson and Fannie Taylor. Ms.
Taylor moved from the South to Champaign in the 1950s with her
grandmother and one brother. She had her first child, Nina, at age 15
and left school due to her pregnancy. Her second child, William, was
born when she was 18. She later married the father of both her children,
Willivery Patterson.
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Jessica Austin : Fannie can you please spell your full name? Fannie Taylor: Fannie Mae Taylor Jessica Austin : Nina can you do the same for me? Nina Patterson: Nina Patterson Jessica Austin : Now, Nina you’re in California Nina Patterson: correct Jessica Austin : ok so Fannie, what do you do for a living? Fannie Taylor: Well, I work for a human service organization family service for Champaign County and I work for a program called information and referral. Jessica Austin : is that what you have always wanted to do. Fannie Taylor: No, not knowing what I wanted to do. Always been in a position helping working with people trying to meet needs always seem to find myself in positions in like that so that’s what I thought that’s what I should do. But I enjoy it. I enjoy helping people. Jessica Austin : What about you Nina… What do you do currently? Nina Patterson: I currently work at a junior college Laney College. And I serve as the dean of students. Jessica Austin : Is that what you have always wanted to do? Nina Patterson: I don’t know if that’s what I’ve always wanted to do, but I don’t mind being an educator. Jessica Austin : Where did you go to school? Fannie Taylor: If we want to go back to my grade school years they were in the Champaign Urbana area… all of my primary education has been here in Champaign Urbana. Jessica Austin : Which schools? And do they still exist? Fannie Taylor: I’m ancient here, but yeah they still do exist. My junior high years was at Edison. My high school year was Central, and from there it was Parkland. A few years of teaching here at the U of I. Jessica Austin : Did you graduate from Parkland? Fannie Taylor: I didn’t. I took selected courses and then just tried them into my interest and the things that I was doing. Jessica Austin : Why didn’t you graduate from Parkland? Fannie Taylor: At that time, I had a household I was trying to provide adequate income things that the kids needed really couldn’t… that was kind of my primary concern. Then I was in myself than trying to enhance my education to the point that I’m only committed to education. So my primary thing was to provide my children with what they needed as well as try to take opportunities to enhance my own education and employment possibilities. Jessica Austin: Nina, did you go to Champaign Urbana Schools also? Nina Patterson: Yes Jessica Austin : Which schools did you go to? Nina Patterson: Well, my mother would probably know more than me. Far as what I remember, I attended button field in Champaign. Fannie Taylor: No no no we never lived in Champaign. Nina Patterson: No I know we didn’t. Fannie Taylor: There was King now, and Webber were the two grade schools and then Urbana junior high and then Urbana High for her. She only went to two grade schools. Jessica Austin: And where did you go to college? Nina Patterson: I attended, Dillard university in New Orleans which is a historically black college and I attended Illinois state University in Normal Illinois and the University of San Francisco in San Francisco California. Jessica Austin : So how was it going to a predominately African American college? Nina Patterson: Well in the beginning it was somewhat of a culture shock, growing up in the Midwest and going to predominately white institutions so it was quite a bit of adjustments and self identity issues that was going on in terms of being in an environment that was predominately African American for the first time out, especially in an African American institution. Outside of my neighborhood and my church growing up. Aside from that one of the things I was able to find my place and what have you, it was a very enriching and enlightening experiences. One of the best experiences that I had in my life. And I think it contributed greatly to how I am today and the person I am today. Jessica Austin: Ok thank you. And Fannie, how did it affect your life having a child at such a young age. Fannie Taylor: how did it affect me. Well actually without a doubt having a child at the young age alters your life greatly. It does not permit you to look at your own self and what it is that you want to do in life because you are now focused on something that you aren’t prepared for. And that is parent hood. So, when you become a parent at a young age, you have to if you are going to be committed to that role you have to willfully give up things that you would like to do… things that other teenagers would like to do. Or you might want to do with them that you can’t do. So you are thrust into a position that is foreign to you for number one, you’ve never done it before, you don’t know how to do it. Even though you may have guardians so to speak extended family members that will help you along the way they keep reminding you that you are the parent. And that this is your responsibility, even though you don’t really know how to meet that responsibility. So, being a teen parent, which I was, really kept me from knowing me , knowing what was ahead of me that I would be able to venture in on and be able to find my place as Nina spoke about finding her place. Her having the opportunity and somewhat freedom to do that being in the position or an environment that would allow her to do that, I didn’t have that being a single parent. So it was difficult, very difficult. If I were to role back time, I would not have done it that way. Jessica Austin : what did your parents think? Fannie Taylor: well being I grew up without parents. My grandmother was my provider. S he of limited very limited education. She as, I think a lot of grandparents aunts, whomever are with you to help you… she provided all that she could provide. She took care of Nina when I went to school. But usually by the time I came home from school the responsibility was mine. She provided all that she could provide. Jessica Austin: and when you were with Nina , had Nina, did you guys live in a mixed neighborhood or not… Fannie Taylor: Mixed as in race? Jessica Austin : right Fannie Taylor: racially mixed… no. we lived in a predominantly black community area of town. And when we moved into our home I got married and you know her dad and I bought into a mixed neighborhood, but when she was first born no we lived in a primarily black neighborhood. And then after we bought our first home it was in a mixed neighborhood. Later years when I bought another home, our neighborhood was mixed only in the sense that maybe or one or two non African Americans lived in our neighborhood in our area. Jessica Austin: Nina, did you and your family attend church when you were growing up. Nina Patterson: oh yes that was definitely a part of our foundation. Jessica Austin : do you remember what church it was? Nina Patterson: oh yeah—tober Baptist missionary church. Jessica Austin: did you guys go every Sunday or… Nina Patterson: Yes every Sunday. Jessica Austin : did you like it? Nina Patterson: oh I enjoyed it quite a bit, and it remains a very prominent part of my life today. I’m very spiritually grounded in it is a part of who I am. Jessica Austin: Do you remember the church? Nina Patterson: oh yes when I go back home it’s just a part of something that I automatically do. I don’t even necessarily think about it. It’s just kind of a second nature that it’s the second family to me, I have a lot of spiritual connections there. And so it’s something that I really look forward to… seeing those individuals and getting an opportunity to interact with them because they had a lot to do to interact with my growing up and my development as a spiritual and Christian young woman. Jessica Austin : Nina, I understand that your bus to desegregate the schools…who was that like? Nina Patterson: at the time that it first began… everyone in my community were bussed for the most part. There were a few people that walked to a nearby school and seemed kind of weird or odd that we didn’t go to the school that was in our community but the majority of us were bused out so you saw the yellow busses all of the time during that school year so it was something that you just did. It was just part of your educational plan, so it was interested and kind of odd, and as kids you kind of adjust… and once you got there. you found that you went from being one of the primary or dominant people in you culture or community to going to another community where you were the minority where you were the isolated one and so you get off the bus and all of the sudden you can count the brown faces and the majority of us rode the bus so it was interesting how and many of the kids that went to that school and did not look like me lived in that neighborhood. I would walk home with them after school because we were in the same after school programs and activities, it was just really odd to me that they were able to go to school in their community but I had to be bused. I just figured as a kid that’s just the way it had to be. I didn’t really question it a lot. At times I would ask my mom why or I had issues being the only black girl or that the only black in a class or in a particular activity, and so as I got older I became a lot more aware and began to ask questions. It was a very interesting experience and it’s something where yes I learned a lot but it would have been nice to have been able to go to school in my own area and not to be bused out necessarily. Jessica Austin: so what do you think about busing now in comparison to what you did as a child? Nina Patterson: Well I think that people need to have the opportunity to go to a school that’s going to be the best fit for their child. I think like when I was in elementary school that the schools that we necessarily went to they were not very receptive I would say and have the best interest in African American kids. I don’t feel that when I look back now as an educator, and all the things that I learned having taught elementary school that I know that my teachers did not act in according to what was in my best interest. As an educator I don’t think they allowed me the same opportunities to study at an accelerated pace or to challenge my thought to put me on a track where I would even excel academically. I think the status quo was different there and if I did it I was fine if I didn’t that was fine too. I mean thank God that my mother was very involved and she was engaged aside from all of the other things that she had to do that she made sure that we got the things that we need. But the educators I don’t think they fulfilled their obligation to make sure that African American kids got the same time of resources and support and services that we needed. I mean I can recall often times African American kids were taken out of class and it kind of made me wonder why we were taken out of class for a reading for this or that often times when I looked around it was often brown faces in those groups. As an educator now that I look back on it I was like this is really interesting… why did they do that? Because I’ve enjoyed education and I felt that I’ve always was a really good student, so I think that was really really interesting. Jessica Austin : do you remember any times where you had to be taken out of the class room? Nina Patterson: yes. I don’t recall exactly what it was for, I want to say it was reading. I can’t remember exactly. I do recall a day in school where I was taken out and we were placed in these groups, and like I said most of us that were there were African American kids. And it was only for a short period of time but I do recall at one grade level, I can’t remember what grade level, but it had to be somewhere like third or fourth grade, I believe it was somewhere in the middle I was taken out for that. Do you remember mom? Fannie Taylor: No I just remember it occurring because you would question as to why it was happening to the black students. And knowing myself, but now that I look back and know more about public schools and programs and funding, it may very well have been that the bused group, which were the black kids were also targeted titled as special needs, so therefore there’s always special money, more money to provide education and service to the black students, so therefore if you always left your black students in the normal class with the “regular” students, then you really can’t get that kind of money. So you have to separate those kids out at a certain point. And they would have to have selected separated education in order for schools to be able to have the funds to have that schools may be applying for. There was obviously more money. What they call special needs. And black kids at that time were considered special needs regardless. Jessica Austin: Fannie, why would you bus your children today if you had another chance? Fannie Taylor: I don’t know. I kind of go with Nina with that I think that because my experiences with public schools, I would take time now to assess all schools in my district to determine which one would be the best one which one would fit my child. If that meant that they would have to go a little further distance if the neighborhood school was not as good as you wanted it to be just because it was around the corner and you could walk to you it and walk home, it would not be enough for me. I would have to look for the school that I thought would give them the best education. So it may be that busing, I would not necessarily feel as good about it, but it would the best. I can’t say that’s the case today, because I’ve been so far removed from my kids being in public schools, but I like the concept of the neighborhood school. T here’s a certain amount of safeness in that and familiarity, not as comfortable… if that was still part of the issue, then busing my kids across town would not be what I would want. If you need to get to them or something it’s always more difficult to do that, because if they’re so far away from you, you know, so I would have to look at schools and I would think that if people have more choice… which still is not allowed, much choice in selecting their schools. I would probably like a neighborhood school and then encourage the district to make that education the best possible. Nina Patterson: I agree with that too the neighborhood schools afford an opportunity for services that students who are bused don’t get an opportunity to take advantage of. I can recall on a number of occasions that after school I would to the neighborhood school to get tutored. I would go to king school because it was walking distance from my home. I could not stay after school at the school that I was bused to because how would I get home? So, the kids in the neighborhood would still end up utilizing services in their community school even though they are not students of that school. Different programs that are laid out and are provided to assist students in their success. So certainly as my mom said I would also give a lot of recognition to the community schools and make sure there was proper funding there to make sure those schools are just as competitive academically in terms of preparing students with a very solid education. Jessica Austin : Nina, did you belong to any sports or clubs when you were in school? Nina Patterson: I was very active in school even as far back as when I was bused, well I’ve always been bused but in elementary school. I was involved in girl scouting and I was the only African American in girl scouting. That bothered me a little bit but not to the point where it discouraged me. I was in it for a number of years from being a brownie to being a junior to the point now where I had such a great experience even though I was the only African American, that now I have my own troupe and I’ve had it for three years. But, for me I think at that time girls were girls and you just played. I liked being involved, and my mother, even though she worked a lot, we worked it out somehow with the troupe leader once a week or every other week when I could go to the meetings that I would go to the troupe’s leader’s house or a near by friend’s house in the troupe as well. My mother would come and pick me up later in that evening. Or a family member would come and pick me up that evening. And just a lot of provisions were made on my behalf because I really was an outsider. Most of the girls that were on the troupe lived right there in that neighborhood. So , whatever the activities were after school my mother we always had to which I’m sure was an inconvenience at times try to figure out how I can still enjoy that experience whether it was being on patrol I was a patrol leader or if it was girl scouting… any type of activities that we would try to make provisions for me to do that. But knowing that it would be a slight inconvenience to the family because the primary thing was defiantly education but my mom had to work and we were so far away from home. Jessica Austin: did you think that your African American friends treated you better than your Caucasian friends or classmates? Nina Patterson: well, at the school when I went to elementary school there were only maybe three families that were at that school and we were all from the same neighborhood. And some of my cousins, there was the Patterson family, the Johnson family and the Jones family and there might have been one other family, the Causley’s. And so we all knew each other and our parents knew each other. And that was right at the first part of integration. I think I came a year or so after that because I had older cousins who were there first. I came shortly thereafter. So I mean those that came after me or those of us that were there… African American we all had an additional connection because either our families or because we lived in the same communities or we went to the same church or our parents knew each other from the work that they did. And being advocates in the community, so we had an additional connection that brought us together. So I don’t think necessarily that it was done intentionally but it was based on the connection that we had outside of school. Jessica Austin : were there any teachers that discouraged you to not go to college at any point in life? Nina Patterson: well yes and no. I don’t think… there were definitely several challenges a long the way were teachers there were some teachers that would not be an advocate on my behalf would not encourage me to accelerate in class or to necessarily recognized what my efforts were what my goals where ask the questions, to try to put me on the right track. There were some that thought I wasn’t smart enough to be in a particular math class or that I should be in a particular science class or writing class. So my mother and I at times we had to challenge the system because they were like she can’t do the work. My mother would say how you do you know she can’t do the work. She’s going to be in this class she’s going to do the work and she’s going to pass. My mother would make sure that when in those situations came up she would challenge the school and I would get in that class and I would work and it would be challenging at times. But I did pass. But a lot of times my mother had to be the advocate on my behalf for my education because if not I would have just been another black student going through the system. I watched and saw a lot of my black friends, especially my male black friends that just got passed through the system. Especially when I got older, especially in junior high and high school. No one really paid attention to them, no one really asked the questions. There were no programs to support them or to encourage them. I mean there were some students, um and you were lucky if you had parents and a mom like myself that was on top of things, but many of them did not have the opportunity or be blessed enough to have a parent like that. So, definitely in high school there was only one African American counselor. The classes were divided by your last name. and I happened to have a counselor that I knew was not an advocate for African Americans because you watch and you see and you hear what people are saying about different educators and so you knew not to go to this person you knew all ready who you should go to. And often times black educators in the public schools in the predominately white intuitions they carry the load for all African American kids most of the time. and that happened in my school. It didn’t matter who you were assigned to, in terms of your counselor. You went to the person you knew who was going to have things in your best interest that was going to tell you about the scholarships that wanted to make sure you were considering college and to make sure you knew you were college ready and that you were college material. So that person definitely was the type of person that made sure that African American students had a voice and that had a voice and they kept it at the forefront of the institution but it’s hard because when it falls on one person, it’s just not as prominent or as productive as if the school as a whole understands that there needs to be a focus on African American kids especially in the elementary schools to our junior high and also with out high school and especially with our African American boys. Jessica Austin: Fannie, what expectations did you have for Nina? Fannie Taylor: well, not just Nina, but for both of the children, by working in the public by working with youth that was experiencing difficulty within the system, I soon learned that he system had earmarked certain kids and treatment was accordingly. I knew that kids from certain neighborhoods were treated differently. I knew that kids that were from one parent families were treated differently I knew that kids that were on public aid and used the what is it that you eat with they give you a pass or whatever it is Nina Patterson: discount lunch? Fannie Taylor: yeah discount lunch or would have free lunch were treated differently. Not wanting mine to suffer through the system they had to be in, they always had their own lunch money if I worked two jobs they had their own lunch money. They even through I was a single parent, we lived in a neighborhood the white society saw it as not poor. Because we were home owners. Home owners are treated differently from renters, especially in certain segments in the community. And because I knew how the system treated and identified and earmarked kids… I didn’t want to fight the system on everything. Now, Nina’s right. I did have to go in and raise some issues and some concerns some eyebrows, and people saying certain things were happening that I knew were happening. Because of my work through a social service agency to work with kids to work with teachers to work with administrators I knew what they was looking at. I knew. Because I knew how they were treating my clients. I was determined that I was not going to have my children and even the kids that I was working with as much as possible to not have to go through a lot of trauma everyday because they’re apart of something that society is saying you must be a part of. And, Nina recalls a time when I really had to act indignant over in Urbana during high school because of the way they wanted to treat her and I wasn’t going to have it. Ok. I wasn’t having it and I sat there in the meeting and they drew in other people and I didn’t care because I wasn’t having it. And when the end result was when I was walking out of that meeting everything was ok because she was getting what she needed and I wasn’t going to let them stop that. If I knew it, if anything happened as a result of the meeting I knew I would be right back over there. Ok. So now, all parents are not in positions to know the system as thoroughly as I think I knew it because their work might not involve them being a part of that or being involved so to speak… they don’t always know what’s occurring. Within the schools that their kids attend and what their kids have to face each day. And I tell people that being a student in public schools is like you a parent going to work. And the fact that kids have to be exposed to multiple personalities ever personality does not treat you in the same way. Some care, some don’t. some encourage some discourage. Some care about you as a person, it has nothing to do with you as a race. Some care about you as a race and they don’t want to be involved with others. Some are concerned as sharing, if you can quote the well. Some like to keep you as a certain level and what they do is make sure you don’t get what you need to excel. To move out of that level. But being the kind of and I don’t’ know where my whole my character I’m sure developed in my mom’s womb, but at the same time I don’t’ know where this forcefulness came from. My persistency in trying to make things better for kids that I was aware of as well as my own that had to walk through this system and come out ok. A whole lot of them didn’t come out ok. My brother he came out at 16 because he couldn’t take it anymore. The way that they treated him as a black male the way that he middle school dropped them in they lowered the level of the school in the basement in the corner with all the other black males, and it was a thing so that he couldn’t take day after day grading, he couldn’t take it. So when he wanted to learn something, he would come home and he would want me to help him. Ok. Because my education was on the first floor or upstairs, and his was one the lower level, with one teacher who supposedly had all of these bad boys that couldn’t learn, which was absolutely not true in the case of my brother because much of what he was able to receive in education was after he got home and we sat down and went over his homework. Then I became his teacher, ok but then as a developing person, man he couldn’t take it anymore so he dropped. He dropped school at 16, he just didn’t want it anymore. He just couldn’t take it anymore because he became angrier and angrier and angrier. And that anger got him to the point where he knew he just didn’t have to. And he didn’t. so I wanted the best for mine, and the way that I could provide the best for mine was to know the system which they had to be in. and I encourage them at home. You know I had to constantly talk to them at home. Things that may proved to be somewhat difficult or the system was making it difficult. We spent a lot of time at the kitchen table. Reviewing the work the home assignment, and then when the teachers would send those home don’t’ help your kids, oh that didn’t mean nothing to me. They tell you don’t help your kids. Now I couldn’t figure that one out. I thought maybe they didn’t want me to help them because I’m going to explain it differently and they have a certain way in which they wanted them to learn it. But, it was to me, the outcome was it was important for them to know it. So my own form of teaching became what happened at our kitchen table and this may be the way but this is how you can get the answer. We did spend a lot of time at the kitchen table. Certain time was meal time certain time was homework time, no TV time at that time no play time at that time. now dr. Williamson was a little different. He was a little different he wanted to slide out I don’t have any homework… sure there was homework in the bag somewhere but it was I didn’t have any homework. Fortunately for him academically he was able to achieve very easily I mean he was one of those people that needed a lot of extra help. He could comprehend pretty quickly. I think that’s one of the reasons he didn’t feel he had to sit down like that like we did. I also enrolled in school I was in school at the same time the kids were in school, a lot of times there were times when I was doing my work and they were doing their work. I think that role modeling is also is to show you that education is important not only at a public school level but as you get to be an adult. Education is still valuable. Jessica Austin : So you do you think or how was your brothers life due to dropping out of school? Fannie Taylor: well, my brother could have been like statistics are today he says that I ‘m sure they say that black males that drop out of school because of their low academic achievement that they end up being law violators, go to prison etc. my brother didn’t do that. I don’t know what kept him out of that but he didn’t do that. He got a job at 16 and he worked as a cook and did it for years. He did construction work but whatever he did was honest work but he needed to have the piece of mind in order to be able to function and he couldn’t get that in public schools. So it was for him it was healthy but times are not the same. You need to have more and there are not enough construction jobs and there are not enough cook jobs and so you really have to strive for more. And because there’s more diversity in the kinds of jobs that you can have you can support yourself and family. At that time he was big and you know he could do a lot of physical kinds of labor and positions and so forth. He did that. He made good money. He took care of himself. He moved away from home and developed his manhood rather early, but he always did well, and he never had to encounter anything like prison. So that was an internal thing I’m sure for him. Jessica Austin: Nina do you think you would be standing where you are right now if you had not been pushed by your mother? Nina Patterson: Definitely not. I know that through her hard work and effort through sacrificing an enormous amount at the time growing up I didn’t realize what was going on because she never made it seem like it was difficult. And being an adult now, and I work with teenage moms and I work with individual that I’m sure are similar to what my mother went through trying to raise two kids getting her education and just trying to be strong and take care of everything that I see how challenging and difficult that is. I have great respect for my mother and I don’t know how she did it. I know for a fact that I would have not be where I’m today, if she had not done all that she did today . even still to this day I know my mother watches over me and not a decision, very few decisions that I make alone often times I consult with my mother I consult with my brother, the three of us we are extremely close. We constantly talk constantly about life changes and her being the mother of two adult children that her opinion still is the highest one in terms of what can we do what shouldn’t we do… do you think this would be good for us because in a lot of ways she knows me better than I know myself even when I doubt myself or I need reassurance or I need encouragement or I need that voice to be that cheerleader, or even for someone to have an objective eye. I will call her to this day and will always value that I’m able to do that. Fannie Taylor: I think she gives me more than I deserve. Nina Patterson: Not enough. Jessica Austin: Fannie do you think that having a mother and a father would have helped you and your brother in your educational experience. Fannie Taylor: that’s a hard one. Not having parents, I don’t know what parents really offer. If I had caring parents, and parents in a position to guide me in all the different experiences to be facing as I was growing up so yeah I’m sure it would have been different. But being raised by my grandmother whose level of education was their grade she couldn’t read she couldn’t write I would read her mail to her, I would write a response to her mail for her. It helped me to enhance my reading skills it helped me to enhance my writing skills. You know helping her helped me. But she couldn’t, the guiding that I needed or the help if I got stuck on something she couldn’t do it. I’m sure that probably bothered her more than I could have ever known. But if I had educated parents, caring parents, my whole outlook on life would have probably been different. I probably would not have to experience so many things on my own. I would have found out a little more about me earlier than later. If I found out more about me earlier, I probably could have directed my path and my life with that instead of finding out a whole lot about me later in life and not be able to do very much about it. You know it’s those dreams and wishes do they come true? They do if you start young with them, but as you get over, dreams and wishes are not as real, so yeah. Having parents would.. and I see people with parents you know I have lots of friends and associates and family members that come from households with parents and I don’t know how this is going to sound and I don’t want it to sound not good. Many of them ended up with children were as problematic or more so and not as much as achievers as much as mine, and mine just had me. So, I think that it’s not always in the number of parents that you have that society calls a complete set meaning two you know one female and one male. It’s not always what’s needed. What’s needed is committed parents… those that are willing to make the necessary sacrifices to make sure that the child or the children have as healthy as a life in as many aspects as possible. And you can do that as one… it’s really testing as one because you do sometime wish that that other person is there so that you can say go to your father. You can’t say that because you’re the father too. It’s like sending the kids back to you. So but yeah two parents can make a difference but they have to be committed and caring and they have to make the sacrifices. You can’t just provide the food and the shelter and clothing and that’s what a lot of people say. I feed you I clothe you I shelter you but there’s more to it than that. It’s all those other things that’s one of those three that everybody like to refer to the three. There’s much more to clothes and food and shelter. So, you got to have that part too. Jessica Austin : Nina, what classes did the counselors tell you to take when you went to talk to them? Nina Patterson: well in high school basically like I said I didn’t really go to my assigned counselor. My counselor was an educator and she had attended Gerogely black college so I was one of those kids that was college bound… I was tracked all ready I was going to go to college you know like I said my mother was very involved. They knew me and my brother. Ok the people in the school the African American educators… they knew my brother and I. and so from junior high on, there were prominent African Americans that were either principals or counselors or teachers that they knew that what I was supposed to do I knew what I was supposed to do and I knew if I didn’t do it what was going to happen, so I had to make sure for the most part that I stayed on my pees and qus. And I said I enjoyed school so I was taking classes that were geared toward what I wanted to do which at that time I thought I wanted to be a nurse. And so I would take some science classes and of course I would take some fun classes. So, defiantly I had classes that would help me to transfer but again my mother was really involved too so I wasn’t just out there picking classes when I went in to the counselor my mother had already talked to me before and there were times when I was like why do I need to take that and my mother was like you need to take this this and this. And I would be like why do I have to take this… I don’t’ want to take typing. Well, when you go to college you’re going to have to type papers and I want to take typing. But she saw what I needed. I didn’t know what I needed. And so my mother was very instrumental in sitting down together with me and us developing my schedule and then I would take it into my counselor and we would sit down and she would say yes this is good and this will help you you know with the next level. And I had a few accelerated classes in high school because again my counselor was there and I proved myself, and I was mostly on the honor roll from the time that you could be on the honor roll, from junior high to high school. Always every semester I was pretty much an honor roll student, but also at that time, Urbana you know in terms of accelerated classes or college prep courses they weren’t quite there yet, like other schools I would say in larger cities. And so there were a few courses in writing I can remember accelerated but at the time I was in my junior year, I had enough credits I didn’t have to go my senior year, and I didn’t want to go my senior year. I enjoyed school so much I went around the clock, I went summer you know I went the regular year, so I had enough credits. I told my mother you know I don’t think I want to go and she was like why don’t you want to go your senior year, and I was like I’m finished and she says yeah but you only get to be a senior once. So I really think that you would really enjoy it. So I went to school for half a day, I didn’t even have to go but I went half a day and continued to take some course in science and education and health profession and I worked community service as Franklin county health service half the day. And it was great and I learned a lot and I think that has a lot to do also with my spirit and giving back and being very committed to the community service, but defiantly working with my mom and my counselors I stayed on track where I can recall some of my friends their parents weren’t that involved. They were just taking class taking classes, didn’t really know how it was going to connect to college or if they were going to go to college. There were very few in my class that went to college. Very very few. Jessica Austin: Fannie did your children like school from what you could tell. Fannie Taylor: well it was kind of hard to tell with my son. He never… I mean he always did like I said fine academically. He never brought home failing grades. If he got a “D” boy I tell you there was sitting down and explain this one. You know you got to explain it if… you know my whole thing is you have all your faculties you’re able to read can you comprehend? Yes I can. Then if you can do these things then there’s no reason for this other. Something less. And if it’s something less, then you’re doing less you committed less so I’m sure it wasn’t real easy to live in a household with me because you had to explain things. If it wasn’t happening then you had to explain why it wasn’t happening. You probably think my god what kind of mother is that? You know well, I think you need to look for yourself. You need to know why it’s not apparent. And if it’s not apparent and it’s something that you can do about then and you’re capable… you’re not illiterate… then you should connect. If you can understand and you can do the work, then what keeps that from not happening. Now if it’s too much play too much social life, too much TV or too much whatever then we have to cut some of that out. Because you have to get through this world and you have got to be able to be able to live hopefully the way that you want to live and achieve the way that you want to achieve. Now, and I wasn’t so much… I was into the education but when Nina spoke about her senior year and how she split it and she went to a half day of school and a half day of work at Francis Nelson, center, she wanted to work full time because she always liked the power of money, and she liked what money could do for her. Ok? And but I discouraged that because I know that or I felt that if you got a job and you liked the money and it was comfortable and your pockets are a little fat and you can do what you want to do and you don’t have to ask anybody for anything… and datada datada … that can become your way and you won’t even seek further education because you got a job and you have money but you don’t have the education that you need to live… and I always asked them how do you want to live? What kind of things do you actually want to achieve. You know what kind of things do you want to aim for. In order to be able to afford certain levels of life you had to have certain levels of education to provide you with possible opportunity. To get the job to pay the money that permits you to live where you want to live the way you want to live, the quality of life you want to have… but you made sacrifices sometimes for and that was another issue that you want to sacrifice for your life for your future are you willing to invest now for later. Are you willing to give high school undergrad that’s x number of years it’ll put you in… and we walked through what kind of degrees can do. So, a bachelor degree will get you at this level, a master degree will put you at this level. And a doctorate will get you at this level. Mind you I use the work potentially because none of it’s guaranteed. But you don’t’ want to cut off the possibilities. So what you do is are you willing to invest now in your future, are you willing to pay now by not hanging out and going to all of the parties and working burger king and you know the 20 hour week and where you go after that and that kind of thing. So my thing to them was that you invest now into the life now that you want for later. And Nina has always has like finance and business and she knew that for her to do that each time she graduated with another degree it enhanced and built her opportunity to do that, and that’s why she’s a dean now. Ok. And lives well…so did the kids like school yeah I think my son liked it… it was a real social outlet for him. He loved handling the students he liked running the halls he liked giving the teacher havoc during the day he did. He had a good time just making somebody else’s life miserable he really didn’t have to sit in class to get what they were offering. He could go in and chew gum… or whatever… he would do whatever they would tell him not to do. Many items that what he did… and I would have to go in and answer to he just insists on.. we would tell him not to chew this gum and blowing these bubbles or whatever he was doing and he would insist on doing it… he didn’t know why he couldn’t do it. And I had to go in and answer to that now, that’s the kind of stuff we would have to have a session at home afterwards, you know don’t make me come in if I don’t have to you know. If I have to come make it something important. But enjoy it yeah.. and to know whether or not your child was enjoying it or not, are they willing to go onto college… to get more than a bachelor’s degree are they willing to get more than a masters degree because every level is harder than the first. And each one of them obviously learned it and enjoyed enough that even now, both of them take classes and they don’t even need anymore education and they both still take courses somewhere along the way of interest, so the answer would be yeah yeah they like it. They had a good time I think. Jessica Austin : Nina, what type of grades did you get when you went to an all black school? Nina Patterson: Well, when I talked about the culture shock it was very big as I had mentioned earlier. Going in as an honor roll student and being a first generation college student, I really didn’t know what it was. I just figured it was the next step and it was school and I had always done very well without really even trying. I mean there were a few courses that were challenging here and there and my mother and I we would work through them, but I mean with minimal effort I did well. College is very different, but when you’re the first person to go in your family in your entire family outside of my primary family and you really don’t have any one to tell you the ins and outs of college and the challenges and what you can and can’t do. It’s kind of learning as you go. I thought it was like high school so when I got there I took like 18 19 units and at that time, when you’re far away from home in a college where we didn’t have any family, even though my mom had some friends down there it was different because I didn’t have my mom there at the kitchen table you know to figure out the class schedule and I trust my counselor but I was unfortunate in the sense that my counselor was new as well and I didn’t know that at the time, and you kind of looked at that person for some guidance, and you kind of looked at that person the first time through. And anyone knows that as a freshman you shouldn’t take 18 or 19 units because I thought it was like high school. You took class at 8 in the morning till 3 in the afternoon, well I fell flat on my face and part of it was being in an environment that I didn’t know anything about being away from home, living in residence halls being a part of a new culture being a part of a majority but a minority at the same time. And just the discipline that it took to go to college. The academics were on a whole different level. I knew that I was really realize and discipline myself I just thought I could give my basic studies and that would be enough but I learned very quickly that it was not enough but it also made me question was I really smart enough… should I actually be there. Was I really prepared for college and that’s why I said I grew up a lot to really kind of deep down in myself ask a lot of questions do a lot of soul searching about who I am and my academics.. who I am and what I need to do in my academics. So it took me not only one semester of falling on my face but because I felt like oh you’re just not trying. So I turned around the next semester and took another 18 units and fell on my face again. Well, I was taking like 2 biology taking some chemistry and taking a lab I had some courses that were terrible and when I look back on them how in the world could somebody have signed on a freshmen with all of these classes? But my advisor didn’t know. She was new. And so after lots of tears and frustration and wanting to come home and talking to my mother I hate this school… it was terrible… it was one of the worst experiences on the opposite sides it was one of the best experiences it changed my outlook on life and about discipline and about working hard and difficult experiences.. and so after my freshmen year and I was on probation, it was the first time I was ever on any type of academic probation I got a new counselor somehow… I think the lady I had had to quit or something like that. And that person got me on the right track. I also changed majors. I was a nursing major. I had prepped for nursing.. I had worked at Francis Nelson center and I really thought that’s what I wanted to do. But after really thinking about it and not doing well in science for some reason I’m not sure why I just wasn’t meant to make the connection at the time probably some of it was maturity and not understanding college I transferred to education. I think that was really the turning point for me and that’s where I was really supposed to be because at that time when I made that change with my major things just began to form to unfold. I got off the probation list I was doing very well in my classes I graduated with honors, and ever since then I have just continued to advance in my career as an educator and I tell my story to students because often times when you have terminal degrees like myself and my brother and people think oh you must have come from a two parent household you must have grew up very well in terms of your finances and they think about all these things and then one night and I asked them … well what kind of background do you think I came from when I go and do presentations to underrepresented students or those that come from underdeveloped backgrounds and they just think that people with doctors and look like me in the type of job that I have that I came from this model environment and I tell them that my mom was a teenage mom and the sacrifices that she made even me in school and how I was on probation finances and I also used to remember that I would cost us a lot of money because I went to a private school in college and my mom… we would take out loans, and I was like I don’t’ want to take out another loan out this is so expensive. And my mom would say you are investing in your life your investing in your education… just think about what this can do for you. It resonates with me so much and I tell those stories to my students and they are so inspired when I talk with them but really it’s the voice of my mom. Because you know everything that I encounter especially with those challenges, they talk me through them. Not necessarily giving me the answers but talking about what the outcome would be if I chose a b or c. so my grades didn’t start out well at all. And it was terrible and I wanted to quit, but my mother would not let me quit. I wanted to move back home, and part of it was yes it was a new environment for me… part of it was adjustment in terms of being in college and some of it was I needed to learn what it meant o be disciplined. Because there I was in college, too much play too much fun and not enough studying, and my mother gave us a lot of tough love. She was right she didn’t accept excuses and if you had one it better be pretty good and very seldom did we have any good ones… not good enough anyway. I thank her for that but she made us think and we had to explain and justify our actions… especially when we feel short. In particular areas that she knew we could do better in. there was a point in time in college when my grades, she felt adjustment period should have been over. And I can remember a conversation that we had and my grades had come out and she said I got your grades because at that time they sent your grades to your parents and now they don’t do that because of law. She said I got your grades and look you better get it together or else I will come and get you. Now I couldn’t have her come all the way to New Orleans Louisiana and very small and private and if you had to pack up your suitcases everybody would see you and that was just too much of an embarrassment, so guess what Nina got it together. That’s why I say that tough love and that disincline is so important. And that’s why I say she knows me better than I know myself. It’s that tough love that’s what really got me through. And that hasn’t happened once it happened when I was getting my masters as well. I had a stats class that I had to pass and I couldn’t seem to get over avoiding it because math wasn’t my best subject I would get through it and you know I remember I was calling her I was stressed out there were a lot of things going on I can’t do this I can’t do this I’m not going to graduate and she was like look get it together. She’s like I don’t know why you think you can’t pass this class. Has there been any class that you’ve put your mind to and you disciplined yourself that you have not been able to pass? And I said no. she said you either get it together again with this stats class and apply yourself, or I’m going to walk to Bloomington Normal and we’re going to have a talk. Well of course I didn’t want her to walk to Bloomington Normal because she would be pretty upset by the time she got there. So, I got it together and I passed with a “B” and I graduated. My mother has done this quite a bit with me and has really made me push myself she would be on what I saw was bearers and limitations that were placed there… but I found out later that I was placing them on myself. And so with the grades at the end of it all I know with application and being able to have discipline and being able to apply myself I do very well.
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